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Faith leaders pray Trump will label Muslim Brotherhood ‘terrorist’

National Religious Broadcasters President Jerry Johnson speaks from behind the lectern during a Faith Leaders for America news conference on Jan. 19, 2017 in Washington, D.C., where the group denounced several Muslim groups. RNS photo by Adelle M. Banks

WASHINGTON (RNS) The day before his inauguration, conservative faith leaders urged President-elect Donald Trump to name the Muslim Brotherhood a terrorist organization.

Members of the Faith Leaders for America, a new ad hoc coalition, seek a stronger response to Muslim extremism in the Trump administration and view the designation of the Muslim Brotherhood as a first step.

“(Y)ou have our prayerful support as you begin to counter jihad and protect Americans from Islamic terrorism,” said National Religious Broadcasters President Jerry Johnson, reading a “Call to Prayer” from the coalition Thursday (Jan. 19).

“When you label the Muslim Brotherhood a terrorist organization, we support you.”

The Muslim Brotherhood is a transnational Sunni Muslim organization that is a powerful political force in Egypt and other Arab nations. It is involved in charitable work, and officially denounces violence. But it has been linked by critics in those countries to violent Islamic groups.

National Religious Broadcasters President Jerry Johnson speaks during a Faith Leaders for America gathering on Jan. 19, 2017, in Washington, D.C., where they denounced several Muslim groups. RNS photo by Adelle M. Banks

Lt. Gen. William G. “Jerry” Boykin, of the Family Research Council, spoke at the Faith Leaders for America news conference on Jan. 19, 2017 in Washington, D.C., where the group denounced several Muslim groups. RNS photo by Adelle M. Banks

Johnson and others, including Lt. Gen. Jerry Boykin of the Family Research Council, also accused the Council of American-Islamic Relations, and other Muslim groups many consider mainstream, of having links to terrorism.

Boykin, an ordained minister, said Christians and Jews should be wary of CAIR because Saudi Arabia and the United Arab Emirates have declared it a terrorist group.

“All of this interfaith dialogue is part of their methodology to infiltrate the church, to draw undiscerning pastors and rabbis in,” he said.

CAIR spokesman Ibrahim Hooper responded that Boykin has a long history of targeting mainstream Muslim groups.

“Jerry Boykin is one of the nation’s most notorious Islamophobes,” he said.

Hooper said this new group’s statements follow the recent introduction of legislation by Sen. Ted Cruz, R-Texas, which would designate the Muslim Brotherhood as a terrorist group. He said Boykin and others are “kind of smelling blood with the Trump administration that finally they can implement their bigoted agenda.”

Some of the leaders at the news conference at the National Press Club said they differentiate between peaceful Muslims and those who support terrorism.

“There’s nothing in that document about generic Muslims, moderate Muslims,” Johnson said, referring to the group’s statement. “We’re just talking about the bad guys, the bad actors.”

About the author

Adelle M. Banks

Adelle M. Banks, production editor and a national reporter, joined RNS in 1995. An award-winning journalist, she previously was the religion reporter at the Orlando Sentinel and a reporter at The Providence Journal and newspapers in the upstate New York communities of Syracuse and Binghamton.

168 Comments

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  • “Boykin, an ordained minister, said Christians and Jews should be wary of CAIR because Saudi Arabia and the United Arab Emirates have declared it a terrorist group.”

    So, two terrorist-countries call a group “terrorist”?? Yeah I’m not totally on board with everything CAIR does, but I’m not going to take the word of the country that ~invented~ Islamic extremism that these guys are the REAL terrorists…

    “All of this interfaith dialogue is part of their methodology to infiltrate the church,”

    Ah yes!! Talking to people!! The most insidious method of taking over the world!!

  • People solidly grounded in their own spiritual convictions will not be persuaded by the “infiltrators;” to the degree that such individuals exist.

  • These guys are looking for a latter-day Council of Clermont. They want the Groper-in-Chief to issue a call to arms against Islam so there’ll be a war against it which (they hope) will wipe it from the planet. Well, good luck with that, fellas. It didn’t exactly work out for the medieval Crusaders who first tried it, and I doubt even the Apricot Wonder will be able to pull it off, now. 

    What’s also interesting is that none of these guys calling for a “holy war” against Islam, are going to be doing any of the fighting. They want a war, and have agitated for it for years, but expect others to do the fighting — and the dying — for them. They’re a phenomenon known as “chicken hawks.” 

    Personally, I’d prefer it if they grew up, for once, and accepted that there’s a religion in the world which rivals their own Christianity. But then, what could I — insolent, cynical, godless agnostic heathen that I am — possibly know about such mightily sacred things? 

  • Ah WWII. The war in which America helped empower Stalin and Communism for decades in the future!!

  • “godless agnostic heathen”

    Those three things… contradict one another you know. Heathens have gods and are certain of them. Agnostics are uncertain of gods. Godless are certain in no gods. 😛

  • Re: “Those three things… contradict one another you know.” 

    Heh heh heh! You’re right. They do! You’re the first to have noticed this since I’ve been using the phrase (and I’ve done so for many years now). But it’s intended as humorous, which I’m sure you surmised already. I can’t claim to have invented the phrase, though: I was actually called a “godless agnostic heathen” once, by a believer (a seriously fundamentalist Christian) way back in Usenet days.

    Anyway, thanks for noticing! 🙂

  • Boykin and others are “kind of smelling blood with the Trump administration that finally they can implement their bigoted agenda.”

    Exactly. The Family Research Council is a hate group and their inclusion in the Faith Leaders for America make the entire organization highly questionable. Boykin is a racist and Christian jihadist of the worst order.

    FLA has revealed itself, via its membership, as completely bogus.

  • I am sure that Genl. Boykin has sufficient knowledge of Islam, but am not sure about his fellows.
    CAIR is not the terror connection. Muslim Brotherhood is not the terror connection. Allah is a terrorist. Open your Qur’an or tafsir to Surah Al-Imran and read 3.151, followed by Surah Al-Anfal for 8.12, 8.57 & 8.60. Turn to Surah At-Taubah and read 9.120: “any step to injure or enrage” is a code phrase for terrorism! Muhammad was a terrorist and proud of it. Open Sahih Bukhari and read 1.7.331 and 4.52.220 for the details.

    Terrorism is an inseverable intrinsic sacrament of Islam. The practice of Islam is incomplete and imperfect without it. The WTC attack o 9/11 was an Islamic act of worship. See the second page of Khalid Sheikh Mohammad’s “Response To The Nine Accusations”.

    Senator Cruz’s legislation is a good start, but it is necessary to declare Islam an international terrorist organization and defrock it. The Free exercise clause is for religions, not Mafias disguised as religions. If you think I am wrong, search for and read “Islam’s Missionary Mission”.

    MINOs lack Iman. There is nothing to stop them from getting Iman without warning and becoming Believers. See Surah At-taubah 9.111 and Surah Al-Hujuraat to learn what Believers do.

  • Obviously very little and I doubt not that most of what you “know” about Islam is untrue.

    The war of Islam against America has been ongoing since 1776. The Barbary Pirates were Muslims.

    Conquest is intrinsic to Islam and can not be severed from it. Blood will hit the fan when Iran mates nukes with ICBMs.

  • Resistance to aggression is not bigotry. Bigotry involves hidebound ignorance and prejudice. Those of us who have read the Qur’an and two sahihs know enough about Islam to condemn it. The real bigots are projecting their bigotry and prejudice onto us.

  • Re: “Obviously very little and I doubt not that most of what you ‘know’ about Islam is untrue.”

    If you’re like most Rightist Americans, I doubt not that most of what you “know” about Islam is untrue, as well.

    Re: “The war of Islam against America has been ongoing since 1776.”

    America had also been at war with Britain at that time. But we’ve since become allies.

    Re: “The Barbary Pirates were Muslims.”

    And many of the other nations we’ve gone to war with, though our history, were Christians. So what, exactly, are you trying to say?

    Re: “Conquest is intrinsic to Islam and can not be severed from it.”

    The same is true of Christianity. You know, the Great Commission and all? Christians have killed to spread the word of the Prince of Peace. So again I must ask: What, exactly, are you trying to say?

    Re: “Blood will hit the fan when Iran mates nukes with ICBMs.”

    And you’re assuming this will happen? On what basis? You’ve got a crystal ball and can see into the future? You think, because of this scenario you’ve imagined, that it’s necessary for the US to go to war with all Muslims around the world?

  • Communism reared its ugly head in Russia during WWI. WWII was a result of WWI in that Hitler hated the Treaty of Versailles that ended WWI as it put severe conditions on the defeated Germans. By the way, the Muslim Ottoman Empire (Turkey) also sided with Germany in WWI, killing 1.5 million Armenian Christians in the Armenian Genocide. Hitler was appeased at first and that is what really led to WWII. Chamberlain appeased him and America did not want to get into another European war. Communist Russia also originally sided with Hitler in the Molotov-Ribbentrop agreement but later Hitler attacked Russia and millions of Russians died. America certainly favored the UK and its allies but Japan’s bombing of Pearl Harbor was what brought America into WWII. To say that America empowered Stalin is ignorance and stupidity. Yes, America gave military equipment aid to Russia when Hitler attacked but at the time Hitler was no doubt the greatest of two evils. You liberals need to study history and get get off the self flagellation of your country. America has not been perfect but certainly more perfect than any other world power in the past. If Hitler and Japan had won, you likely would be speaking German or Japanese today. And if America had not stood up to Communist Russia in the Cold War, you’d likely be speaking Russian today. There will always be evil in this world. Good men…and women…will always take a principled stand against it. Right now that evil rising is Islam, the most persistent of evils. Hitler’s facism lasted a little over a decade; communism in Russia lasted less than a century; Islam has been threatening the world for over 1400 years off and on. EVIL HAS TO BE CONFRONTED!

  • Muhammad “invented” Islamic extremism 1400 years ago. CAIR subscribes to the same ideology that the Muslim Brotherhood subscribes to…that is, the Quran (supposedly Mo’s revelations from his allah god), the Hadiths (sayings of Muhammad), and the Sira (Muhammad’s life). If CAIR, like ISIS or Al Qaeda could take power, you can bet that Islamic Sharia Law would go into force immediately and unbelievers like you would have to convert to Islam, or live as dhimmis (second class citizens) in their Islamic world paying the extortion Jizah tax, or die.

  • Boykin knows Islam and you do not. There is no such thing as a Christian Jihadist. Just using that term indicates you know Jihadist is a person who kills for his Islamic allah god…AKA Satan. You’d better wise up or you will be on an Islamic prayer rug with your arse in the air five times a day…or beheaded.

  • “The Muslim Brotherhood is a transnational Sunni Muslim organization that is a powerful political force in Egypt and other Arab nations. It is involved in charitable work, and officially denounces violence. But it has been linked by critics in those countries to violent Islamic groups.”
    When Anwat Sadat signed the peace treaty with Israel in 1979, he also signed his death warrant at the hands of the “violence denouncing” Muslim Brotherhood in 1981. The allah god of Islam forbids making a realistic long term peace with unbelievers so Sadat was killed (read about Muhammad’s Treaty of Hudaibiyya…Yassar Arafat referred to it to his cohorts after signing the peace treaty with Israel in 1993…Muhammad set the example by breaking the treaty after just two years.). The allah god actually calls for war against unbelievers until Islam is supreme. The MB is outlawed in Egypt. The article lacks a few facts. Lt. General Jerry Boykin knows Islam for the EVIL that it is. Muhammad prophesized that in the end times “a rock will cry out, ‘there is a Jew behind me, come and kill him'”. So much for the fools errand of making peace with Muslims.

  • There is a verse for you in the Quran…Sura 9-5, which says, “…slay the pagans with every strategem of war…”. You will probably have no problem becoming an allah god fearing Muslim when you have a Muslim’s knife at your throat.

  • Your answers display your ignorance. On the last item, think of the leadership of the country of Iran as having the same mindset as an Islamic suicide bomber. Their threats of “Death to America” and “Death to Israel” are founded in their evil religion, Islam.

  • Re: “Your answers display your ignorance.”

    And yours display your sanctimonious outrage that there are actually people in the world who DARE be so insolent as to have a religion other than your form of Christianity! Why, the HORROR of it is too much to take!

    Re: “On the last item, think of the leadership of the country of Iran as having the same mindset as an Islamic suicide bomber.”

    That could only be true if they’d destroyed their own country. They’ve had a few decades to do so, but haven’t. So your comparison fails, on its face. Try again.

    Re: “Their threats of ‘Death to America’ and ‘Death to Israel’ are founded in their evil religion, Islam.”

    Your threats of “Death to Iran” are, likewise, founded in your own evil religion.

    You know, this might be news to you, but were you aware that Iran is not the entirety of Islam? Oh yeah. For real! There actually are other countries out there which have Muslims in them. You seem not to realize that Iran does not equal Islam, so I thought you should know.

    Oh, and another thing you probably don’t know … the Islam that’s practiced in Iran, (aka Shi’a) isn’t the same as the Islam practiced in most other Muslim countries (aka Sunni). That’s why Iran and Saudi Arabia (which is a champion of the Sunni sect) are locked in proxy wars against each other in Syria and Yemen, among other places. Yeah, really! And those Muslims whom you think are all united in wanting to destroy the US and Israel, are actually too busy fighting each other to be able to do so.

    All of this, I’m sure, is news to you, and I’m happy to have educated you. Now, you militant Christianists should grow up and start acting your ages, please. The rest of us would appreciate it. Thank you.

  • You apparently do not have access to any news sources on Islamic bombings, beheadings, rapes and other atrocities going on in the world where the Muslims holler, Allahu Akbar as they kill people. The violence in the Old Testament is historical and God’s interaction with the Jewish people in taking what is current day Israel. Yes it was bloody but one does not see Jews killing people today and pointing to Joshua’s taking of Jericho or anything like that…and certainly not Christians. My faith in God is based on the teachings of Jesus Christ in the Gospels and the New Testament, but primarily in the Gospels, where there is no violence except maybe against Jesus Christ by the Jews and Romans who crucified Him. Jesus teachings are love and forgiveness. Yes, I do have a problem reconciling God’s direction to Joshua with Jesus Christ’s teachings. Jesus said, “The Father and I are one” and “you have seen me, you have seen the Father” and “no one come to the Father except through me”. I would probably be an atheist like you if not for Jesus Christ and his eye witnessed miracles and teachings in the Gospels and death on the cross and Resurrection…as many Jews are atheists today who do not believe in Jesus Christ. Islam came along 600 plus years after Christ and the hate filled violent exhortations supposedly by the Islamic allah god (unwitnessed) are 180 degrees opposite Jesus Christ’s teachings of love and forgiveness (and NO miracles). I personally believe that the Islamic allah god is Satan. Muhammad thought he was possessed by a demon on his first encounter with the being in the cave in 610 A.D. His wife convinced him it was from God. Then there are the Satanic Verses (Salmon Rushdie) where Mo agreed to other gods and the allah god told him in another unwitnessed revelation that Satan fooled him. I conclude that Satan fooled him on the entire religion.

  • Just wondering why an atheist is so strong in his support of Islam, Satan’s religion…my conclusion from 15 years of studying Islam…since 9/11/2001 is that the allah god is Satan. I have no problem with Buddhism or Hinduism or Confucianism as none of those religions want to kill unbelievers as the allah god of Islam exhorts in 9-5, 9-29, 2-193, 8-12 and a 100 other verses of hate against unbelievers. Yes, I do believe Christianity is, in Jesus’ words, “the only way to the Father’, but people have to come to that belief after reading the accounts of Jesus Christ’s teachings and miracles in the eye witnessed Gospels…not by force as Islam’s allah god supposedly teaches in the Quran.

  • “If you’re like most Rightist Americans, I doubt not that most of what you “know” about Islam is untrue, as well.”

    When
    I first got internet access in the summer of ’01, I began reading
    message boards about the subject and found links to the Koran and
    hadith, which I read. Since then, my digital library has grown to
    include sharia, sira and exegesis.

    “America had also been at war with Britain at that time. But we’ve since become allies.”
    There
    is no parallel between the war of revolution and the Barbary Wars. The
    Muslims fudged the treathy in a deceptive manner and, as soon as they
    regained enough power, renewed their attacks. Muslims are enemies, not
    allies; nine ayat expressly forbid alliance with infidels. Two ayat
    expressly command perpetual war.

    “And many of the other nations we’ve gone to war with, though our
    history, were Christians. So what, exactly, are you trying to say?”

    Jesus Christ neither commanded nor exemplified conquest; Moe did. Tripoli’s Ambassador told Thomas Jefferson:
    “It was written in their Koran, that all nations
    which had not acknowledged the Prophet were sinners, whom it was the
    right and duty of the faithful to plunder and enslave; and that every
    mussulman who was slain in this warfare was sure to go to paradise. He
    said, also, that the man who was the first to board a vessel had one
    slave over and above his share, and that when they sprang to the deck
    of an enemy’s ship, every sailor held a dagger in each hand and a third
    in his mouth; which usually struck such terror into the foe that they
    cried out for quarter at once.”

    A similar answer was given to the Persians in Sahih Bukhari 4.53.386″
    Our Prophet, the Messenger of our Lord, has
    ordered us to fight you till you worship Allah Alone or give Jizya (i.e.
    tribute); and our Prophet has informed us that our Lord says:– “Whoever amongst
    us is killed (i.e. martyred), shall go to Paradise to lead such a luxurious life
    as he has never seen, and whoever amongst us remain alive, shall become your
    master.”

    The command referenced above is in Surah At-Taubah 9.29 and codified in Reliance Of The Traveller Book O, Chapter 9.8.

    “The same is true of Christianity. You know, the Great Commission and
    all? Christians have killed to spread the word of the Prince of Peace.
    So again I must ask: What, exactly, are you trying to say?”

    False!
    Show me where in the N.T. Jersus Christ issues the functional
    equivalent of 8.39 , 9.29 & 9.123. Parables, metaphors and
    allegories do not cut the mustard, show me the N.T. imperatives!

    Jesus
    told his Apostles, when the Gospel was rejected: “when ye depart out of
    that house or city, shake off the dust of your feet.” Moe told his field commanders: “If they refuse to accept Islam, demand from them
    the Jizya. If they agree to pay, accept it from them and hold off your hands. If
    they refuse to pay the tax, seek Allah’s help and fight them”.

    “And you’re assuming this will happen? On what basis? You’ve got a
    crystal ball and can see into the future? You think, because of this
    scenario you’ve imagined, that it’s necessary for the US to go to war
    with all Muslims around the world?”

    It
    appears that you have missed all the threatening statements and
    promises of conquest from the Ayatollahs. Beyond that, you have not
    read Sahih Bukhari so you do not understand Islamic eschatology. It is
    too much to explain in a comment.
    They believe that by starting a world war, they will hasten the end of the world and their grand entry into Jannah.

    Islam is permanent war. After his cougar died, Moe got his living by his spear: plunder. Read Surahs Al-Anfal & At-Taubah of the Koran to get a clue.

    Once you have read At-Taubah,. re-read 9.38-39 and follow up with 78.21… Then read 9.111 again. If that does not clear it up for you, resume reading at 61.9. The essence of Islam is go to war or go to Hell. If you are not accruing spoils and jizya for Moe and his successors, you are gonna burn. If you do his wet work, you get admitted to the celestial orgy. The Jihad can not end until there are no more Muslims. One Believer will recruit or breed more and the war will resume.

    One book may help you to comprehend that important concept. Download “The Book Of Jihad” from the internet archive and read the table of contents.

  • It is not without reason that I exhort the ignorant to read the Koran & sunnah. At minimum, everyone should read the Jihad chapter of Riyad Us-Salaheen which brings most of the important ayat and ahadith together in one place.

  • It is Marxism, not Atheism that screws them up. They hate Capitalism so much that they love anything that promises to eradicate it. They arrogantly assume that they can pick up the pieces and start over with Marxism after the conflict. They do not realize that Communists were prime candidates for hanging after they deposed the Shah.

  • Your audience lacks the background information required to process what you have revealed to them. They have not read the Qur’an & two shahih hadith collections. For them, thee is a short course: “What’s Wrong With Islam & Muslims?”. “Islam 101 For Clergy & Congregants” goes into more depth.

  • Jerry Boykin is not a bigot: he knows the fatal facts of Islam. Informed opposition to Islam is based on the evil mission and methods of the institution, not the race or culture of its acolytes.

  • Apparently you are gullible enough to follow the propaganda of Islamicists. By equating the entire religion of 1.4 billion people with the acts of somewhat recent politically supported miscreants, you are doing the work of terrorists.

    Never mind that Muslims make up the majority of victims of these extremists.

    As for the rest of your spiel, it is interesting. In a wondering whether you were abusing some kind of prescription drugs while typing kind of interesting. Not going to touch it with a 10″ pole.

  • So you really have no idea what Muslims actually believe or how they practice their faith. Nothing related to actually knowing or interacting with actual Muslims. Much like pretending to know about sex by reading Penthouse Letters.

    If one was to judge Christians based on the gospels you would think they are all beneficent moral people. Yet when you actually speak to many of them you see how scripture is used to justify bigotry, dictatorship, mayhem, genocide and dishonesty at all levels.

    So you can spare us all the bullshit of pretending know anything about a religion based on isolated (most likely fictional) quotes from scriptures.

    You don’t know much about the Barbary Wars either. Those were largely won by making alliances with Muslim leaders who opposed the pirates.

    Much of what we know of Islamicist extremism is more recent than you will honestly admit. Most of it dating back not much further than 1979 with the Iranian revolution and Saudi retrenchment.

    By demonizing the entire faith of Islam you enable terrorists. You attack the one thing which is useful for conbatting terrorists. Muslims committed to democratic ideals.

  • Have you read: The Noble Qur’an, Sahih Bukhari, Sahih Muslim and one unabridged Sira? Have you read Book O, Chapter 9 of Reliance Of The Traveller, Chapter 30 of Risala or Al-Sayir, Book IX in the second volume of Hedaya? Have you read Churchill’s famous quote from The River War? If so, why do you remain clueless?

  • You strike me as someone who is faking it. Getting their info from an islamaphobic site and pretending they read the book themselves.

    Have you actually met or interacted with real live Muslims? You do not give the impression to me as someone who has.

    Your spiel is akin to talking about sexual relations based on what they watched on Cinemax.

  • The Muslim Brotherhood is an Islamist organization. They would like to see Sharia established in America. The Evangelicals are working to implement their own version of Sharia. The Communists would love to see America embrace communism. The Anarchists have their own version of America. I don’t agree with any of them. But here in America you have have and espouse your ideas as long as you violate no laws. I don’t have any fear of these groups because of how our government is frame. So I have no reason to single out American Muslims. Face it, it’s your religious hatred of Islam that drives you.

  • OK I admit it! The Afghani guy who runs the “meat and rice” truck near my office, who came to the US with his family to flee the Taliban, is secretly trying to murder his infidel customers.

    Through overuse of Goya seasoning, hot sauce and white sauce of unknown provenance, he is trying to raise everyone’s sodium levels to an absurd degree. All for $6.

    You are an anti Muslim bigot.

    Boykin is an all around bigot. Spewing nonsense about Muslims, atheists, progressive Christians, gays…

  • “Islam has been threatening the world for over 1400 years off and on. EVIL HAS TO BE CONFRONTED”

    ISIS thanks you for your most generous support. They didn’t even have to pay you for parroting their propaganda.

    Why do you like making life easier for terrorists?

  • Dajjal, In my opinion, they hate Christianity so much that they love anything that is opposed to it, whether Islam, Communism, or Facism…all evil. My personal feeling is that they have a common sense short circuit because the hate God or those who believe in Him. Yes Muslims claim to worship God but the allah god is NOT the same God (I believe the allah god is Satan as you know) and most/all of these atheists have not had to deal with Islam in Islamic countries. One atheist that knows Islam is Ali Sina at faithfreedom.org. Here’s a link to one of his articles on Islam. Also intended for some of these ignorant Islam supporters. http://www.faithfreedom.org/what-moderate-muslims/

  • Jim, you are comparing Islamic apples to Christian oranges. The teachings of each should be examined…the Quran (their allah god’s supposed word to Mo), the Hadiths (Mo’s sayings), and the Sira (Mo’s life). Compare the hate there against unbelievers exhorted by the Islamic allah god. Then go to the eye witnessed Gospels stating the teachings of Jesus Christ (basically love and forgiveness) and His many eye witnessed miracles. If you cannot discern the difference then you can never understand. I am a Christian because I believe the Gospel words of Jesus Christ that He is One with the Father and the Only way to the Father. If I did not believe this I would not be a Christian. Mo comes along 600 years later and say that his allah god says that Jesus never said He is the Son of God and that Jesus did not die on the cross and that he, Mo, is the final prophet. This is a bald faced lie by this Muhammad guy, who spread his religion by robbing, murdering, and killing those would would not accept his religion. Jesus says in the Gospel of John 8:44, that Satan is the father of all lies. Since I believe the Gospel writers and not the unwitnessed testimony of the Mo guy lying against the Gospels (actually the Quran is claimed to be his allah god’s word to him), I believe Mo’s allah god was/is Satan..In fact, Mo thought he was possessed by a demon on his first encounter with the being in the cave in 610 A.D., but his wife convinced him it was from God. Yes, I hate Islam because I consider it evil and Satanic. I do pray each day that Muslims will leave their evil religion and come to faith in Jesus Christ…but alas, there is a death sentence for any Muslim trying to leave. That is the glue that holds many in Islam.

  • I am more concerned about people like you running around with your head in the sand. If the West truly knew Islam and spoke the TRUTH about it and contained it, Islam would die on the vine. As is, you have idiotic Merkel and other European leaders welcoming the Trojan Horse of Islam into their societies and the non Muslims will eventually pay for that mistake. We in America have brought in the Muslim Obama and he also has done a pretty good job of destroying America and supporting Islamic subversion in America via his many Muslim appointments and other actions like Islamic immigration. The Muslims will not assimilate and most of them favor Islamic Sharia Law over our Constitution. Islam’s goal is Islamic supremacy as stated by the supposed allah god in Quran Sura 2-193. Muslims who disagree with their supposed allah god are really not Muslim, but there is a death penalty for leaving Islam….it’s called Death for Apostasy.

  • Even Mafia Dons have rivals. Northern League, Taliban and others all wanted to occupy the seat of power. But that rivalry takes a back seat to punishing Kuffar for not being Muslims. In Britain, Muslim butchers and bakers have ben caught delibrately polluting food with fecal matter. Muslim hate is undimmed by victim status. The real bigots are projecting their own bigotry onto Boykin and others who know the truth about Islam.

  • You may find it offensive, but my takedown of the inaugural and cia addresses is up at Crusader’s Armory. Five footnotes on one quote.

  • That little blog is old and not maintained. Links to CMJE, Hilali/Khan and Reliance are broken by off site server changes. With the exception of Reliance, curious readers can get the texts in pdf from the internet archive and verify the qotes.

  • Shari’ah is Islamic law, derived from the Koran and hadith. Christianity had a reformation and no longer pretends to temporal power. Islam can not reform and continues to conflate spiritual and temporal law.

    I began learning about Islam in July of ’01. On Sept. 11, when I heard the first report, I presumed it was a civil aviation accident. When I turned on the idot box and saw it, I knew the truth. I spent the rest of the day cursing . I lost my voice for three days.

    An esitmated 270 million innocent people have been slaughtered by Muslims in the name of Allah in the last 14 centuries. That is more than enough.

    Anyone who does not hate Islam is either ignorant or morally impaired.

  • My interaction with Muslims has been limited to web chat rooms, Facebook and blog comments. I have had plenty of interaction with them on Disqus.

    I actually read two Qur’an translations, looked up many verses in several tafsirs and read the four hadith collections available at CMJE and Islam Universe. I read The Sealed Nectar, the first two volumes of Ibn Sa’d and parts of The Life Of Muhammad. I read volume VIII of Tabari. And much more. I read enough Islamic law to veify what I learned from the other texts. I have them in pdf format so I can search them.

    The fruit of my research is a blog page entitled “Islam 101 For Clergy And Congregants”.

  • I drifted away from FFO long ago, haveing difficulty accessing it. Sina is a genuine expert.

    Thee is enough evidence in Bukhari, Abu Dawud, Muslim and the Qur’an to prove the Satanic identity of Allah. I put it together in “Allah Is Not God” and “Islam Is Demonic”. Those files are linked in “Islam 101 For Clergy & Congregants” but not embedded in “Islam 101 For Politicians”.

    It may be prejudice, but I perceive most vocal Athiests to be Marxists who hate Capitalism and everything that supports it. Those who want to subvert America will support anything perceived to weaken it. This field is open to multiple causation.

  • OK. So you are just playing at knowing anything about the subject. It’s pretty clear by the nature of your arguments that you cannot be taken seriously. There is no way a lesson can come up with generalizations of a religion of 1.4 billion people in such a,way which does not smack of bigoted lazy nonsense.

  • You went to what madrassa to study the Koran?

    Can you read poetic Arabic?

    How many years did you live in a Muslim community?

    Yep, self published wankery from someone with an inflated opinion of their knowledge of the subject.

  • I see you are a bit humor impaired as well. Haters are generally too wrapped up in trying to be taken seriously to notice such stiff.

    Are you sure the Muslim butchers aren’t just doing that to you? You appear to be the uncivil sort likely to annoy people in a food service industry.

    Generally people who use the term, “the real bigots” are ones who are trying to weasel out very well established and documented prejudicial remarks and statements. Boykin’s bigotry is clear enough. I am not surprised you would throw your lot in with such a low character.

  • You are doing the work of ISIS and you are too self absorbed, hateful and stupid to realize it. Extremists want lazy thinkers like you to equate their evil nonsense with the entirety of Islam. It is great for recruiting. It gets hateful fools like you to attack the people most likely to cause damage to their cause. It gets people to excuse actions likely to radicalize communities.

    You are the worst kind of stooge. Someone too thickheaded to realize you are being played.

  • Bullshit. He links to half digested sources put out by hate groups. Akin to when neo Nazis start quoting the Talmud when they want to discuss their farcical great Zionist conspiracy.

    BTW great sockpuppetry on your part.

  • You are the one who is lazy and you judge Islam by good people who happen to be Muslim and don’t practice their religion as the allah god wants…or is it Muhammad? At 9/11, I was a blank page on Islam and agreed with those fools who pointed at the Crusades as the reason for all this Christian/Islamic enmity (I learned that Islam started attacking Christian lands some 400 years before the Crusades (1096 A.D.) after Muhammad’s death in 632 A.D. I got a copy of the Quran (Abdullah Yusuf Ali translation) from the Houston islamic Society’s ad in the Houston Chronical and read it. I read Serge Trifkovic’s Sword of the Prophet and Robert Spencer’s “Politically Incorrect Guide (PIG) to Islam” and “The Truth About Muhammad”, all content taken from Islamic sources. I went through the Quran and compiled a list of verses that exhort Muslims to violence against us unbelievers and came up with over 100. I started reading the story of every Muslim who left Islam because I felt their stories were supported by the death for apostasy sentence in Islam. One does not take leaving Islam lightly and many are killed doing so, so that adds credence to their stories. I read Wafa Sultan’s (former Muslim) “A God Who Hates” and saw the video of her debate with Daniel Pipes on whether Islam could be reformed. Wafa won the debate…No! Islam cannot be reformed. I read Mark Gabriel’s story on the web. He was an imam at Egypt’s Al Azhar University and after struggling with Islam came to faith in Jesus Christ, the TRUTH…His father tried to kill him for leaving. I read Ayaan Hirshi Ali’s story “Infidel”. She wrote the screen play for Theo Van Gogh’s movie, “Submission”, and he was killed for that production by a Muslim and she was threatened with death. I will match my study of Islam with anyone. Islam’s teachings are a recipe for eternal fighting among mankind. Islam is a curse on mankind. Satan should be pleased with his evil religion. All one has to do is see Muslims killing, beheading and raping today and have knowledge of Islam’s history and it becomes VERY clear that Islam’s teachings are the ROOT cause of this insanity. I have read over 30 books on Islam since 9/11/2001.

  • Yes, Boykin is a bigot. Judging by your words, you are either ignorant or a bigot yourself.
    If you read the Christian bible you’ll see significant amounts of violence, hate and bigotry. I guess it’s a terrorist religion.

  • You really should become a Muslim. You are almost there with your defense of Islam. Just say the Shahada and you’ll complete the transition. “There is no allah god but the allah god…aka Satan, and Muhammad is his robbing, murdering, pedophile false prophet.” There, I did it for you. All one has to do is go to the Quran like 9-5 and 9-29 and 5-51 and 2-193 and 8-12 and see the hate. One really does not have to go to Dajjal’s other sources which support the Quran verses I list.

  • No incumbent of any US political office should be free from justified criticism. Hell of an improvement over the illegal we had in the White House. I do hope he gets the Truth on Islam from his advisers.

  • All you have is empty calumny with which to smear your superiors. You project your own bigotry onto others because you can not debate the issue with facts.

  • If you read the Qur’an you will find that in 2.216, Allah ordained fighting for Muslims. In 31.51, he sanctified terrorism. In 8.12, 8.57 & 8.60 he commanded Muslims to terrorize. In 33.26 & 59.2, he said that he cast terror. If you read Sahih Bukhari 1.7.331 you will read about Moe being helped by awe within a one month’s radius. In 4.52.220, he said that he was made victorious with terror.

    Reading inter alia, in 9.120, you will see that Allah awards Brownie Points for acts of terrorism.

    We have facts, you have smears. Facts trump smears.

  • Trump is orders of magnitude superior yet not sufficient. Walid Phares can wise him up, given sufficient time. I do not know how much face time Phares, Flyn & Mattis get or how they utilize it.

  • People who make wild generalizations about 1.4 billion people are in no position to accuse others of bigotry. Nor are they interested in facts.

  • So now you are flinging poo at me, rather than the 1.4 billion Muslims in the world. You are a compulsive hater.

  • You really should find a saner form of discourse. Attacking an entire faith of over a billion people based on skewed readings of their scripture is never going to produce an intelligent or rational argument.

  • Says the person who is doing exactly what ISIS wants you to do. Demonizing the entire Islamic faith makes their job easier.

    After all what is the end point to your pov?

    Genocide of all Muslims?

    Mass forced conversion?

    Discriminating against all Muslims in democratic countries?

    These are the things ISIS tells people to inspire fear and aids recruiting. You are their stooge.

    You are a bigoted fool.

  • Piracy is warfare now??

    Interesting.

    Damn Christians!! Their pirates were the pirates behind the “Golden Age” of piracy!! And apparently we now judge groups based on the standards of the pirates among those groups, so Christians are just the WORST. 😛

  • “Communism reared its ugly head in Russia during WWI.”

    No duh, but the Allies only exacerbated the tide of Communism by excusing and ignoring the acts of their Ally Stalin…

    Or are you blind to the way you through Poland under the bus during that war??

    “Communist Russia also originally sided with Hitler in the Molotov-Ribbentrop agreement but later Hitler attacked Russia and millions of Russians died.”

    “America certainly favored the UK and its allies but Japan’s bombing of Pearl Harbor was what brought America into WWII.”

    FDR provoked (yes ~provoked~. Japan repeatedly sought diplomatic channels with the US and FDR’s socialist administration regularly and openly antagonized their diplomats) and capitalized on the attack to trick Americans into going into a war they wanted NOTHING to do with prior to the attack.

    FDR wanted the attack so he could enter the war on the side he wanted. And it was a little more than ~favoring~.

    “I just have a hunch, that Stalin doesn’t want anything but security for his country, and I think that if I give him everything I possibly can and ask nothing from him in return, noblesse oblige, he wouldn’t try to annex anything and will work with for a world of democracy and peace.” -FDR.

    Total acquiescence to the dictator. FDR was the America’s Chamberlain to Russia’s Hitler.

    “To say that America empowered Stalin is ignorance and stupidity. Yes, America gave military equipment aid to Russia when Hitler attacked but at the time Hitler was no doubt the greatest of two evils.”

    My family saw both sides, both forced from their homes under threat of execution in the USSR AND placed in German work camps. Look at the Death Toll. Stalin was worse than Hitler EVER was, and the only reason that fact is obscured is because they were the US’s ALLY.

    “You liberals need to study history and get get off the self flagellation of your country.”

    I’m so pro-Free Market I think Trump’s protectionist schemes are blatant socialism. Try another strawman. Study history ~yourself~. Stalin was OBJECTIVELY WORSE, and the socialist, tyrannical FDR admired him as a figure to look up to, which is the reason he wanted to help the Communists during that war.

    “America has not been perfect but certainly more perfect than any other world power in the past.”

    Rampant socialization and unpopular foreign war under FDR has rather diminished it.

    “If Hitler and Japan had won, you likely would be speaking German or Japanese today.”

    Study history yourself. Japanese didn’t want a war with the US if it could be avoided. The Japanese never even sought conquest to the US. They thought after Pearl Harbor that the US would roll over and cancel oil embargoes against the Japanese. Unfortunately for the Japanese Government, they were unaware that FDR was looking for ANY excuse to sacrifice American lives for his European buddies, and America went to war instead.

    The Germans wouldn’t have sought conquest of anything apart from their “living space” in Europe, because holding a MASSIVE amount of land across the seas is just not feasible for a central European government as pressed economically as Nazi Germany was.

    But either way, you and I both know neither Japan nor Germany had the resources to maintain a hold over the ~overseas~ mainland United States. So language would not be a concern.

    And avoiding the war that only the corrupt, socialist FDR administration wanted, when the VAST majority of Americans DID NOT, was preferable than fighting on either side!!

    But like a progressive, FDR just had to put the interests of foreign, socialist governments over the well-being of the American people.

    “And if America had not stood up to Communist Russia in the Cold War, you’d likely be speaking Russian today.”

    But Communism would never have been a threat if the US hadn’t helped Russia against Germany in the first place. We let Americans die so that Russia could maintain a hold on Poland and Eastern Europe. Americans died to save the lives of Russian troops. Huzzah.

  • “The Noble Qur’an”

    Yep.

    “Sahih Bukhari, Sahih Muslim and one unabridged Sira? Have you read Book O, Chapter 9 of Reliance Of The Traveller, Chapter 30 of Risala or Al-Sayir, Book IX in the second volume of Hedaya?”

    Hadith is bull.

    “Have you read Churchill’s famous quote from The River War?”

    Churchill: a fat, corrupt socialist politician buddy-buddy with fellow fat, corrupt socialist politicians Roosevelt and Stalin. I can’t have a good view of the man or anything he said after he decided to bomb a city out of pure SPITE, filled with refugees from both Stalin and Hitler and no major military targets. My family was at Dresden, trying to escape Hitler and Stalin. Churchill’s opinions are worth nothing to me.

  • You can not contest the facts: Jihad is a tenet at the core of Islam, mandated by 2.216, commanded in 8.39, 9.29 & 9.123, confirmed & exemplified in Sahih Bukhari 1.8.387 & 4.53.386 and codified in Reliance O9.9.

    You can not contest the fact that terrorism is sanctified in 3.151 & 8.12, commanded in 8.57 & 8.60, rewarded in 9.120 and exemplified in 33.26 & 59.2. You can not contest the fact that Moe bragged about it in Bukhari 1.7.331 & 4.52.220.

    You can not contest the fact that Khalid Sheikh Muhammad submitted to the military tribunal a statement in which he declared 9/11 to be an act of Islamic worship and terrorism their greatest duty to Allah.

    You can not contest the fact that Allah threatened those who do not perform Jihad with the fire in 9.38-39 and promised eternity in his celestial orgy in 61.9…12.

    You are in a sad position: compelled to defend the world’s worst evil with meritricious arguments.
    All you can do is smear critics of Islam with ‘bigot’.

  • Allah issued commands to the Ummah. Offensive Jihad is a communal obligation. Defensive Jihad is an individual obligation unlimited by age, gender or social status. When we retaliated for 9/11, Jihad became fard ayn. Terrorism: acts intended to injure or enrage kuffar, are sanctified as a tactic of Jihad.

    As always, you project: you are the one making brown spots on the wall.

  • The O.T. conquest mandate was limited to Caanan. Hebrews were not commanded to conquer the entire world as Muslims are. The rest of their battles were defensive, not offensive.

    Nothing said or done by anyone else subtracts from the evil of Islam.

  • Of course I can contest it all. I can’t even assume your citations are correct or your interpretation of them are even close to the ones accepted in the faith. You aren’t reciting facts, you are reciting a very poorly informed opinion.

    More importantly your entire line of argument is bullshit.

    Your skewed take on a given scripture which you have never read from the standpoint of belief has absolutely no relation to a religion in practice. You cannot judge a religion by its writings especially in the nonsense way you allegedly read it. I still think you are just copying and pasting citations from a hate site. I sincerely doubt you have ever even read the Koran. You have not established you even have a baseline knowledge to discuss the topic.

    For example a study of the Bible would make one conclude that Jews believe in a harsh draconian dogmatic faith when the opposite is true in practice. The Christian Bible points to a pacifistic, anti materialist, charitable belief. But in practice conservative Christians are some of the most malicious, hateful, dishonest and self serving people put there.

    You are still a bigot because you are making patently dishonest and malicious statements about an entire faith for purposes of excusing bad behavior against them.

    By equating all Islam with terrorists, you are an ISIS stooge. Just parroting what they say about the west.

  • Two of the eight volumes of Ibn Sa’d have been translated and uploaded. Download them from the internet archive and search for letters. When you find them, read the entire section, with emphasis on the letter to the rulers of Ayala.

    “Embrace Islam and you will be safe.” What if I don’t? Moe said that “he who testifies saves his wealth and life from me.”. Those terms belong to a brigand, not a prophet.

    While looking for something else, I found a quote in Muquaddimah, written about Arab culture, that lines right up with an infamous saying of the Profit.

    Their
    sustenance lies
    wherever the shadow of their lances falls.

    My
    provision was placed under the shadow of my spear

    Nothing said or done by anyone else subtracts from Islam which is evil by design.

  • Except for the fact that your citations are most likely bogus. Looks like cut and paste from a typical hate site.

  • Islamic hadith are not bull, they are human excrement. The Qur’an is nothing but ahadith compiled into an anthology. One surah was eaten by a goat and half of it was lost. The Qur’an was collected after many hafiz were killed in one battle. Many verses had to be obtained from those who had memorized them.

    Some hadith were fabricated, others weak, some strong and others rated authentic based on their chains of narration. No proof. No substantiation, no corraboration in comtemporaneous sources. Unfortunately, that’s all there is and Muslims believe that excrement.

    Imam Bukhari supposedly winnowed down hundreds of thousands of sayings to less than five thousand. His collection and that of Imam Muslim are claimed to be the most authentic and serve as sources of Islamic law along with the Qur’an.

    The Qur’an was not written by a pen on Allah’s dictate 50k years before the creation, it was fabricated on the fly to meet the needs of the moment. Visit your favorite hadith search engine and look up “was revealed”, you will get plenty of proof. Then look up Sahih Bukhari 6.60.311 for the clincher. Aisha finked on her husband.

    With all his imperfections, Churchill was a great leader who saved Britain from certain conquest. He wrote the The River War long before getting into politics.

    Can you discredit his description of Islam with relevant facts about Islam? How about those of John Q. Adams & Disraeli?

  • Evidently the concept of paralell sources escapes you. Tafsir al-Jalalayn and Fafsir ibn Kathir are readily available. The King Of Jordan runs altafsir, a dot com domain that has four tafsirs and several Qur’an translations.

    The Mariful Qur’an, in eight volumes, has extensive commentary that adds a great deal of detail. Try reading the commentary on 59.3 to see how Moe’s companions engaged in terrorism using fire.

    Allah said that he would and did cast terror 3.151, 8.12, 33.26 & 59.3. He said that Moe and his army were more a terror in the hearts of the Jews than Allah 59.13. Moe said that he was made victorious with terror Bukhari 1.7.331, 4.52.220. Those statements form a pattern whidh you refuse to perceive. You can find full quotes with links to source texts here:

    https://www.scribd.com/doc/110516023/No-Justification-in-Islam-for-Terrorism-in-a-Pig-s-Anus

    Open your Qur’an to 9.120 and get a clue:

    “That is because they suffer neither thirst nor fatigue, nor hunger in the Cause
    of Allâh, nor they take any step to raise the anger of disbelievers nor inflict
    any injury upon an enemy but is written to their credit as a deed of
    righteousness. Surely, Allâh wastes not the reward of the
    Muhsinûn”

    At Qiyama, Allah will weigh your sins against your good deeds. The swing of the balance will determine your fate. You get extra credit for acts of terrorism. This is a clue for those who can grasp it.

    Open Reliance Of The traveller to Book O, Chapter 9 and read O9.1 over and over again until the full meaning sinks in. Then clarify and verify it by reading page 18 of “The Book Of Jihad” which makes a direct quote of Al-Shafi’i.

    We do not learn about Islam by chatting with Muslims over Turkish tea or listening to fast, smooth talikng liars spinning tales of a “great religion of peace” . Learning the truth about Islam requires some dilligence and perseverence.

    Craig Winn tried to make it easy for you in the “In His Own Words’ appendix to “The Prophet Of Doom”. Download and read it, but be awarned that Winn melds five Qur’an translations for effect.

  • Select, right click the citations and select search from the context menu. Qur’an citations can easily be found at Islam Awakened and CMJE, Corpus Quran and many other sites. Citations to Tafsir Ibn Kathir can be checked at Qtafsir. Hadith citations can be checked at CMJE and Islam Universe. I link to those sources in most of the blog posts making those citations. Go to the Islam Exposed blogspot and enter the object of curiosity in the search window in the upper left corner.

    Hedaya, Risala, The Book Of Jihad, A Summary Of Islamic Jurisprudence, The Sealed Nectar, The Life Of Muhammd, The Life Of The Prophet Muhammad, Noble Qur’an, Tafsir al-Jalalayn, Tafsir Ibn Kathir and Mariful Qur’an can be downloaded in pdf format from the internet archive. Reliance Of The Traveller, Tabari and the others can be purchased in hard copy from Amazon.

    Note: the hadith collections claim to be complete but are not. The Khan translation of Bukhari has been Bowdlerized. You can find the whole thing on Aisha Bewley’s wib site, but the numbering system is different and there are no named anchors.

  • OK so it is all cut and paste from sites of sketchy provenance. Nothing in relation to how the religion actually treats it’s own adventure.

  • Evidently the idea of credibly presenting outside information escapes you. You have made it certain that you are cutting and pasting from predigested interpretations from sites looking to demonize the religion. I sincerely doubt you have done any of that kind of research.

    That being said, your whole line of argument is rather goofy, yet typical of people discussing religions that are not their own. Also typical of those looking to make wild generalizations for bigoted purposes.

  • Rather than reinvent the wheel, I direct you to an old thread. Search Google for “Allah ≠ God, God ≠ Allah Lying Troll skwills is Called Out!”.

    Scroll down past the two embedded pdf files to the post.

    I answered a troll on my blog after comments were closed on a Disqus thread. I responded in detail, with quotes linked to source texts. I challenge you to disprove what i wrote there. Disqus is enabled on that blog.

    Search for “Freedom Ain’t Free Islam Is Demonic”
    This blog does not have Disquis, just the WP comment system. It is a bit older, some of the links may be broken by external changes. Try to refute it point by point.

    Those posts quote the Qur’an, hadith and Sira.

    Search for “Islam’s Mercenary Mission” The first serp is to a compiled pdf, the second is the original post. Try to refute it point by point.

  • Go to Amazon and spend $25. for each of 40 folumes of Tabari and find out. As alternatives, try Kittab Al-Magazhi and The Conquest Of Syria. Ibn Kathir’s Sira is in four volumes, it adds info from the Qur’an & tafsir to Ishaq’s Sira. Read it and weep.

    Nothing Islamic has any provenance. The Qur’an, hadith & Sira are all second and third hand mouth to ear guff. But they define and exemplify Islam; what Islam is and Muslims do.

  • The Magnificent Nineteen exposed me to Islam;’ gave me all the exposure I want. 17% of Muslims read the Qur’an in their native tongue, the lrest know little about it beyond what the hear in the mosque.

    When the Qur’an was written, written Arabic lacked vowels and diacritical marks so there were seven variant readings. The language has change over 14 centuries, so modern Arabs can not understand their book.

    Qurtubi,
    as-Suyuti & Kathir compared parallel verses and ahadith to determine the meanings of the Qur’an. Hilali & Khan used Yusuf Ali’s translation and three tafsirs in making their Noble Qur’an.

    Moe did what the Qur’an said. That is why each of the six sittah has a book of Jihad. That is why Ishaq’s Sira is full of ghazwa, raids, conquests, attacks, expeditions and murders.

    Allah said fight them until; Moe said I am commanded to fight with men until. But you can’t connect the dots. Moe waged 86 battles in his last decade but you can’t connect the dots. The four rightly guided caliphs conquered nearly half the know world but you can’t connect the dots. You refuse to see the pattern.

  • Much like Jesus, Muhammad isn’t around to field questions on interpretations of scripture attributed to him.

    The whole notion of evaluating a religion based on what you think it’s scripture says is complete and utter bullshit. It says nothing about how it is used in actual practice.

    The Bible tells us nothing about how Jews and Christians actually practice their faith. The Koran is no better for Islam.

    This is just bigots being too lazy to find out anything about a religion and using fairly personal and in most cases probably fictional or exaggerated text cites and interpretations.

  • According to your take on the subject.

    What actual Muslims believe is something you have zero clue about. For example, Jesus was essentially an anti materialist, pacifist type. Good luck finding such sentiments in mainstream Christianity. It’s nowhere to be found.

  • Again, you are doing nothing to indicate actual knowledge as to how the religion is actually practiced. You appear to be copying and pasting from sourced having nothing to do with such things.

  • Rather than present ideas in a credible fashion you do what many other purveyors of bullshit do. Avoid web cites and pretend you are reciting from a book when you really copy and paste from websites nobody would consider objective.

    Holocaust deniers do it, Dominionists, creationists, and now Islamophobes.

  • You keep trying in vain. You make lots of excuses for Christians wiping out entire villages, pillaging and raping, while failing to see that the same applies to Islam. You might as well just let it rest.

  • Try thinking logically instead of hysterically. It would be an improvement.

    Christians engaged in conquest acted in contravention of the teaching and example of Jesus. Muslims engaged in conquest act in obedience to Allah; in emulation of Moe. Somehow the difference escapes you. There is no moral equivalence. Islam is intrinsically evil, Christianity is not.

  • So when you’ve got nothing else, get insulting and simply insist. Well, that works just as well as anything else you’ve said.

  • Islam has five pillars and a peak. The pillars are shahada,saum,hajj,zakat and salat. The peak trumps everything; do you have a clue it is?

    Visit your favorite Koran search engine and search for obey. You will find injunctions to obey Allah and the Messenger. Search for example, you will find an excellent example to emulate. What did he do? What did he have done to Rafi, Asma bint Marwan and Kab Ashraf? What did he do to the Banu Qurayza? How can a Muslim obey Allah and emulate Moe without performing such acts?

    Go look up what Khalid Sheikh Muhammad wrote about 9/11, that it was an act of worship and a great duty. Try to grasp a clue.

  • Your concession. Is duly noted.

    Obviously you lack a coherent intelligent response so you resort to flinging poo and as hominem responses.

    What passes for online discussion by those of a reactionary bent has really degenerated into cretinism. Sorry Snowflake. Obviously the discussion got too hard on you and you had to resort to personal insults. Maybe you will come up with something better next time.

  • That’s no more true than anything else you’ve said. Clearly, engaging with you is a waste of time so I’m done. Just keep up your hating with like minded people who will just nod their heads. Bye.

  • Visit any of my blogs, read one of my recent posts, click through and follow the links. Islam Universe, CMJE and Islam Awakened are not Jewish or ‘right wing’ hate sites. Hedaya is the Islamic law used in colonial India and the Ottoman Empire. Risala is the fiqh of the Maliki madhab. Start here: http://www.crusadersarmory.blogspot.com/
    The two pdf files embedded on the landing page include screenshots from Hedaya. You can download the two volume set from the internet archive and compare them.

  • Your discourse is akin to claiming to know about sex by reciting from Penthouse Letters.

    My guess is the sight of hijabs at the checkout counter at my local Walmart will send you into a cateleptic fit. Maybe the Islamic elementary school next to the Catholic Church two blocks from my home will let you into a coma.

  • Maybe when you grow up you will learn how to carry out a discussion without being reduced to petty insults. Maybe even posit an intelligent point or two supported by facts.

    But you are a long way from that. I can’t help it if your entire spiel is inherently goofy.

  • You are correct. Did not recognize the name of the founder of Wahhabism, if that’s what it’s called. All he did was reform Islam back to what he felt the original teachings of Muhammad were…that is rob, kill, plunder the unbeliever, take sex slaves and have sex with nine year olds…nice guy, like Muhammad.

  • I tend to agree with you on FDR and his taking us to socialism. Whether he allowed the Pearl Harbor attack is pure conjecture, don’t know. To roll over after that attack and do nothing would just have invited more Japanese imperialism. Germany then declared war on us. From my view we had no choice but to confront evil. Do not agree with your view. You cannot prove your stay out of the war view would have worked for the betterment of America. I think Chamberlain proved that appeasement does not work.

  • Now that is not what I said. Nor do you appear interested in my argument.

    You want to pretend you know jack squat about a religion based on what little of its scripture you read online and without context, then try to do the same with other religions. You will be laughed out of the room. But evidently when the subject is Islam, common sense goes right out the window.

    And just to hammer the point home, this tactic began online years ago with Neo Nazis quoting the Talmud and Torah to claim “the great Zionist conspiracy” exists and they Jews will betray and attack any other faith.

    So of course calling people bigots for being so lazy and engaging in such silly generalizations is appropriate.

  • Uncle Vladdie sent a response by email, asking me to post it for him. I would not have used the singular since you do not have a monopoly on bigoted responses. Other than that, I am in agreement with Unk.

    “First you act proudly mentally incompetent, claiming that ALL the facts we use, and every translation of the Qur’an and hadiths made by native Arab-speaking muslims into English, are “wrong!” Every last one of them, right? Then you say “You have to ignore all the muslims’ own histories where they brag about their conquests, slaveries and murders of all the non-muslims, because they are all wrong about their own histories, too!” Meanwhile you call everyone here who actually relies on the muslims’ own most official facts and histories, “bigots,” “racists” and other slanders, yet when it’s revealed that you’re the only real biased racist bigot here, suddenly you pretend to take the moral high ground! You are demonstrably nothing but a pathetic lying criminal hypocrite and fraud.”

  • Re: “When I first got internet access in the summer of ’01, I began reading
    message boards about the subject …”

    So, you with your Internet message boards chatter know more than I do, when I took a year of Islamic history in in university? Heh heh heh … you’re out of your league and don’t even know it!

    But wait! I know exactly what you’ll say. That I’d been indoctrinated by a vile Communist professor and hoodwinked into thinking Islam is the best thing since sliced bread.

    But wait! That’s wrong. My professor was an emigrant from Lebanon, raised Muslim but converted to Christianity. He was also no Communist.

    But wait! You’ll tell me he lied and only pretended those things in order to swindle all the young skulls full of mush (to use a Limbaugh-ism) in his class.

    But wait! You can’t possibly know that. You weren’t there. You have no standing whatever to review my professors’s sincerity or beliefs. So before offering any such protest, you need to think better of it and not offer it at all.

    Re: “One book may help you to comprehend that important concept. Download “The Book Of Jihad” from the internet archive and read the table of contents.”

    I have no intention whatever of reading any of your militant anti-Muslim propaganda.

  • Re: “Just wondering why an atheist is so strong in his support of Islam …”

    So … my refusal to assume that all Muslims are murderous barbarians bent on maiming, looting, and killing somehow makes me a “supporter” of Islam? To be clear, not assuming the worst of every Muslim on earth is by no means “support” of them or their religion. Not in the least. Also, if you go to my blog you’ll find I’ve critiqued Islam plenty.

    Lastly, I’m no atheist. You might actually want to know what you’re talking about, before talking about. Oh, but I forgot … you’re a militant Christianist! You don’t have to actually know anything about something in order to talk about it! You’re automatically a credentialed expert in any and every subject you ever wish to discuss, because Jesus. Or something.

  • Re: “You apparently do not have access to any news sources on Islamic bombings, beheadings, rapes and other atrocities going on in the world where the Muslims holler, Allahu Akbar as they kill people.”

    Of course I “have access” to those stories. I’m not ignorant (like you). It’s true some Muslims have done those things. But not all. And you might want to comprehend that they target other Muslims more often than anyone else.

  • Re: “On the last item, think of the leadership of the country of Iran as having the same mindset as an Islamic suicide bomber.”

    If the leaders of Iran thought like suicide bombers, their country would have been laid waste decades ago. Grow up and stop throwing tantrums over Islam’s very existence.

  • Re: “You will probably have no problem becoming an allah god fearing Muslim when you have a Muslim’s knife at your throat.”

    I would never convert to Islam, not even at knifepoint. I will not do it. Ever. But, by the same token, I will never convert to Christianity, not even by force. So go ahead. Lock and load. Track me down and force me to become a militant Christianist like you. It won’t work, but by all means, please give it your best shot. I invite you to do it.

    Oh, and … what makes you think being religiously militant right back at other religions’ militants is any way to solve the problem of religious militancy? Just wondering.

  • First off, in the last 16 years, I have read the eye witnessed Gospels of Jesus Christ at least 10 times and the teachings are sound and good. On 9/11/2001, I was pretty much a blank page on Islam. I saw some quotes about Islam and thought they were taken out of context. I got a copy of the Quran and read it though plus read more than 30 books on Islam, many by apostates who left Islam under the threat of death for apostasy. Jesus Christ says in the Gospels that He is One with the Father (God) and I believe His statement, as should anyone who calls himself a Christ follower. He said “You have seen me, you have seen the Father. He also says that He is the Only way to the Father and that NO one comes to the Father but through him. He backed His statements up with many miracles, curing lepers, giving sight to the blind, feeding 5000 and again 4000 with just a few fishes and loaves, he raised 3 people from the dead, and then Himself on the 3rd day as He said He would. That is my faith. Reading the Quran and other sources, I learned that Muslims believe the Quran is the allah god’s revelation to Muhammad via the angel Gabriel (unwitnessed). The Quran, written 600 to 700 years after the Gospels, says that Jesus never said He is the Son of God and that Jesus did not die on the cross. The allah god also says he has no sons. These are lies against the eye witnessed Gospels about Jesus’ statements and teachings. The Quran teachings against unbelievers are full of hate and calls for slaying and subjugating unbelievers and Muslims act on those allah god commands. Muhammad performed NO witnessed miracles. In contrast, Jesus’ message was to believe in Him and one of love and forgiveness. He actually says to “love one’s enemies”, which is hard to do. Based on the above differences between Christianity and Islam and Islam’s allah god’s LIES against Christ’s divinity and death on the cross, I have concluded that Islam was revealed by Satan. Muhammad thought he was possessed by a demon on his first encounter with the being in the cave in 610 A.D. and tried to kill himself but was convinced by his wife (only one at the time) that it was from God (also see Salmon Rushdie’s Satanic Verses). Jesus says in John’s Gospel 8:44 that Satan is the father of all lies, so from Jesus’ words, I come to that conclusion (Satan) about the allah god of Islam. Relative to your statement about locking and loading and forcing you to be a Christian, Jesus, when he sent His apostles out to spread the Gospel (good news), he told them that for those towns who do not accept the message, to shake the dust of the town from their feet and go on…no forcing anyone…not you either. He does say that whoever does not believe in Him is already condemned. It is in this spirit of saving unbelievers from damnation that I and other Christians preach the Gospels to be accepted voluntarily. Those who follow Islam are enemies of Christ because Islam’s allah god said Jesus is only a prophet and Jesus did not die on the cross and none of Christ’s teachings of love and forgiveness are in the Quran. I pray for Muslims to come to faith in Christ. That is how I show my love to Muslims and also I am very convinced that their allah god is Satan and want to save them from damnation. I would encourage you to study both religions to understand the differences and understand my logic. I also pray for Hindus and Buddhists and atheists to come to faith in Christ, but they do not have god’s that call for killing unbelievers. Muslim’s are the only ones that kill based on their allah god’s exhortations in the Quran. Islam and Christianity cannot both be true revelations from the one God…one has to be false…or both, but my faith and the eye witnessed Gospels says that Jesus Christ is the TRUTH, the WAY and the LIFE as He says in the Gospels. May God bless you and help you discern the TRUTH.

  • Re: “First off, in the last 16 years, I have read the eye witnessed Gospels of Jesus Christ at least 10 times and the teachings are sound and good.”

    And I’ve studied Christianity’s texts — including the New Testament in its original language, κοινη Greek; the Old Testament in the (Greek) Septuagint, which is how most of the earliest Christians knew it; and the Church Fathers in their original languages (Greek mostly, but some in Latin). I also have studied Christianity’s history, from its origins to now. So yeah, you just go right ahead and brag about your studies. Yeah. Have a ball.

    Re: “On 9/11/2001, I was pretty much a blank page on Islam.”

    As were most Americans. I wasn’t, however.

    Re: “I got a copy of the Quran and read it though plus read more than 30 books on Islam, many by apostates who left Islam under the threat of death for apostasy.”

    I’m sure that told you everything you needed to know about the religion. The best way to learn about something is always to read about it from people who have hateful agendas against it, right?

    Re: “The Quran, written 600 to 700 years after the Gospels, says that Jesus never said He is the Son of God and that Jesus did not die on the cross…. These are lies against the eye witnessed Gospels about Jesus’ statements and teachings.”

    Yeah, I know it’s simply awful to know there are actually people in the world who believe different things about your Jesus than you do. I mean, how dare they? Who do they think they are? What insolence! What abominable creatures! Why, it cannot be tolerated! No one on the planet is allowed to think anything about Jesus which you, TruthWFree, haven’t personally prescribed for them!

    Re: “Relative to your statement about locking and loading and forcing you to be a Christian, Jesus, when he sent His apostles out to spread the Gospel (good news), he told them that for those towns who do not accept the message, to shake the dust of the town from their feet and go on…no forcing anyone…not you either.”

    So, why are you preaching at me, still? Why haven’t you (metaphorically) “shook the dust of [my] town from [your] feet” and simply walked away? Why did you bother replying to me at all?

    Psst: I’ll tell you why. It’s because you can’t actually “shake the dust of [my] town from [your] feet,” even though your Jesus instructed you to do so. You can’t give up and you can’t relent. You just can’t stand the fact that there are people in the world (whether non-believers like me, or Muslims, or anyone really) who doesn’t believe the things about your Jesus that you believe. It’s just not in you to be able to live with it. It irks you and you can’t stand to think about it.

    Look, that’s OK. I once was like you. I was a fundie too. I felt the same things. I get it. Really! I’ve been where you are. I understand you more than you do yourself. You probably don’t accept that, but again, that’s something I know and understand. The reason I don’t still think the way you do, is that I grew up. You can, too. You just have to give it a try sometime.

    Re: “That is how I show my love to Muslims …”

    Calling all Muslims murderous barbarians who’re required to maim, loot and kill for their al-Lah, is not “love.” I can’t really say what it is, but I can say it’s not “love.”

    Re: “I also pray for Hindus and Buddhists and atheists to come to faith in Christ, but they do not have god’s that call for killing unbelievers.”

    Nor do a lot of peaceful Muslims, either.

    Re: “Muslim’s are the only ones that kill based on their allah god’s exhortations in the Quran.”

    Ah, there’s that nice, warm, fuzzy Christian “love” again … calling all Muslims killers. Well done! How wonderful of you to cast aspersions uniformly on billions of people at once!

  • I do not use sockpuppets nor am I one. Unc is a Canuck I have corresponded with for several years. I was able to persuade him to start a blog of his own.

  • “I have no intention whatever of reading any of your militant anti-Muslim propaganda.” Marks you as a close mided bigot who shields his fact free opinions from relevant contradictory evidence.

    So you studied the various caliphates, dynasties, schishs, heresies etc. Did the course expose you to Moe’s threatening missives and the assassinations he commissioned? Did you study the ayat and ahadith that sanctify barbarian rapine?

  • How long is it going to take you to realize:
    1. I don’t take you the least bit seriously.
    2. There is nothing left for us to discuss

  • I knew what I was dealing with from your first comment. I am simply pointing out the sad reality: the Islamist side has nothing but logical fallacy: ad-hominum & tu-quoque. The intrinsic evil of Islam, clear on the face of the Qur’an, tafsirs, hadith, sira & shari’ah is indisputable.

  • Re: “Marks you as a close mided bigot …”

    … except for the fact that avoiding bigoted propaganda isn’t “bigotry.” Try again.

    Re: “So you studied the various caliphates, dynasties, schishs, heresies etc.”

    Yes.

    Re: “Did the course expose you to Moe’s threatening missives and the assassinations he commissioned?”

    It mentioned them, but in other courses I learned all about the persecutions, assassinations and wars Christians waged against each other and against non-Christians. Overall I don’t see any meaningful difference, historically speaking.

    Re: “Did you study the ayat and ahadith that sanctify barbarian rapine?”

    Yes, and I also learned, in other courses, about Christians sanctifying brutality. For example, when papal forces sacked Beziers in 1209, and their leader was asked how soldiers should know the difference between residents who were faithful Catholics or Cathar heretics, he told them, “Caedite eos, novit enim Dominus qui sunt eius” (or “Kill them all, the Lord knows his own”).

    Yeah, I know an awful lot about what religious folk are capable of. Christianity isn’t appreciably more virtuous in this respect than any other religion. You probably disagree, but that’s your problem, not mine, since the historical record is clear on the matter.

  • There are those who falsely quote: “If there was no religion there would be not be any war”
    Many atheists claim that religion is the cause of most wars. However, the history of human warfare shows that less than 7% of all wars have had religious causes.
    But the unanswerable question is: How many people would have been killed if there was NO religion?
    “If men are so wicked with religion, what would they be if without it?” — Benjamin Franklin
    But did you know?
    Currently, there are about five Islamic terrorist attacks a day. Some big, some small.
    But it adds up to a constant war being waged by Moslems against all non-Moslems everywhere in the world simultaneously.
    Islam has killed more people in THIS decade, per year, than the ENTIRE 350 year history of the Inquisition.
    Moslems are CURRENTLY responsible for the deaths of more Moslems, each year, than all the rest of the deaths of Moslems that are killed by all other peoples.
    Could it be that it is the MIS-USE of religion that is at fault?

    The difference is:
    Christians are horrible people when they act CONTRARY to Jesus’s example.
    Moslems are horrible people when they FOLLOW Muhammad’s example.

    “When people in other bona fide religions follow their doctrines they become better people — Buddhists, Hindus, Christians, and Jews. When Muslims follow their doctrine, they become jihadists.” — Clare Lopez

  • William T. Cavanaugh in his Myth of Religious Violence (2009) argues that what is termed “religious wars” is a largely “Western dichotomy”, arguing that all wars that are classed as “religious” have a secular (economic or political) ramifications. Similar opinions were expressed as early as the 1760s, during the Seven Years’ War, widely recognized to be “religious” in motivation, noting that the warring factions were not necessarily split along confessional lines as much as along secular interests.

    In their “Encyclopedia of Wars”, authors Charles Phillips and Alan Axelrod attempt a comprehensive listing of all wars in human history. They document 1763 wars overall, of which 123 wars have been classified to involve a religious conflict, which is an astonishingly low 6.98% of all wars. However, when one subtracts out those wars waged in the name of Islam (66), the percentage is cut by more than half to 3.23%.

    That means that all faiths combined – minus Islam – have caused less than 4% of all of humanity’s wars and violent conflicts. Further, they played no motivating role in the major wars that have resulted in the most loss of life.
    The truth is, non-religious motivations and naturalistic philosophies bear the blame for nearly all of humankind’s wars. Lives lost during religious conflict pales in comparison to those experienced during the regimes who wanted nothing to do with the idea of God – something showcased in R. J. Rummel’s work “Lethal Politics and Death by Government”

    Non-religious wars:
    1.) The Seven Years’ War (Britain & France)
    2.) The American Revolution
    3.) The French Revolution
    4.) The Napoleonic Wars (France & Europe)
    5.) The Revolutions in the Americas
    6.) The Wars to create and preserve the British Empire (Boer War, Irish Revolution, and the Great Game with Russia would all be examples)
    7.) The American Civil War
    8.) The Crimean War
    9.) The Spanish-American War
    10.) World War I
    11.) The Italian invasion of Ethiopia
    12.) The Spanish Civil War
    13.) Stalin’s invasions of Finland, the Baltic states, and Poland
    14.) World War II
    15.) The Chinese Revolution
    16.) The Cold War, including but not limited to the Korean War, the Cuban Missile Crisis, the Vietnam War, the American intervention in Grenada, and the Soviet campaign in Afghanistan
    17.) The Cultural Revolution in China (If you don’t want to call this a war I’ll concede it)
    18.) Pol Pot’s Khmer Rouge Revolution
    19.) The Falklands War
    20.) The Persian Gulf War between Iran & Iraq
    21.) The Persian Gulf War between the United Nations and Iraq
    22.) The Breakup of Yugoslavia (beginning with Slovenia).
    ———————————–
    Brain: Pinky, are you pondering what I’m pondering?
    Pinky: Gee, I don’t know Brain, but except for wars with Moslems, what other wars since the Thirty Years’ War, from 1618 – 1648, has been fought over ‘religion’? Narf!
    Brain: Sometimes you astound me, Pinky!
    Pinky: Poit!

  • Re: “There are those who falsely quote: ‘If there was no religion there would be not be any war'”:

    Some may have said that, but I didn’t, so I have no idea why you’re going on about this.

    Re: “But did you know? Currently, there are about five Islamic terrorist attacks a day. Some big, some small.”

    But did you know … there’s also something known as Christian terrorism? You appear not to comprehend that ANY religion that claims exclusivity can breed militancy, extremism, and yes, terror. That’s ANY religion. ANY of them.

    Re: “The difference is:
    Christians are horrible people when they act CONTRARY to Jesus’s example.
    Moslems are horrible people when they FOLLOW Muhammad’s example.”

    Look, I get it. Islam is so awful that it must be wiped off the globe, and Christianity is unassailably virtuous and perfect. I get it. Really. I do. I understand how you think. (Better than you do, in all likelihood.) But your position is, quite honestly, ridiculous and laughable.

    You dismiss any possibility that Christianity is responsible for atrocities, when one of the worst atrocities ever committed in human history (i.e. the Holocaust) has its origins in Christianity’s centuries-long tradition of anti-Semitism. It could never have taken place otherwise, and makes no sense except as an extension of Christianity’s historical vilification of Jews and Judaism.

    Grow up and get over yourself already, Christian. I’m onto you and your games. (I once played them myself, in my own fundie days … so stop assuming you can fool me. You can’t. On your best day, you have zero chance of fooling me on my worst.)

  • Re: “William T. Cavanaugh in his Myth of Religious Violence (2009) argues that what is termed ‘religious wars’ is a largely ‘Western dichotomy’, arguing that all wars that are classed as ‘religious’ have a secular (economic or political) ramifications.”

    Cavanaugh doesn’t really understand history, then. You see, wars generally have multiple motivators, and are usually the result of longstanding conflicts that take time to become wars. The reality of conflicts, before they scale up into outright violence, is that sometimes they’re ameliorated before they break into open war. When religion is overlaid on them, however, that often makes amelioration or mitigation impossible, because when the two sides think their deity is behind them, they have no incentive to try to compromise or ratchet things down. Their deity demands they fight … and often tells them they’ll win … so they have no reason not to.

    Cavanaugh doesn’t account for this effect. Because he (and others who think like him) don’t want to.

    I can think of one series of wars that, all things considered, can only be described as religiously-motivated, and that would be the Crusades. Sure, they were carried out by warlords and princes looking for territory and to get back at old rivals (e.g. Bohemond of Taranto who wanted to get back at his nemeses, the Byzantines). Many Crusaders were younger nobles hoping to get titles that they’d otherwise have had no chance to inherit. There was also the chance to acquire a lot of loot. So yeah, there were motivators other than religion involved. No one with a brain would possibly deny it.

    But with that said … they were expeditions by western Europeans to the Levant and elsewhere far to the east. If these warriors were simply looking for lands to conquer, titles to seize, and loot to scarf up, there were plenty of places they could have done so, a lot closer to home. Some of the Crusaders had done just that … e.g. Raymond of St Gilles, duke of Toulouse, who’d already finished a long career campaigning in Spain against Muslims there; and the aforementioned Bohemond, who’d campaigned against the Byzantines in the Balkans and elsewhere. There was no reason for any of those men to venture thousands of miles just to get land, loot, and titles. The risk was considerable, and the expense staggering, compared to expeditions much closer to home.

    No, the only reason they’d have ventured that far, deep into very hostile territory, was the take the Holy Land back for Jesus … and that can only be viewed solely as a religious goal. It just doesn’t make sense any other way.

    In addition, Cavanaugh is limiting himself to “wars,” but I don’t, and you shouldn’t either. As I said, the Holocaust descended directly from centuries of Christian anti-Semitism. Oh yeah, I know all about the terrible economy of post-WW1 Germany, and how the German people struggled under the terms of Versailles. I get that they were just looking for scapegoats to vent their rage and frustration, which was primarily economic. Yeah, I get it. But the fact that they settled on Jews as their scapegoats, can only be viewed as a religious impulse.

    Put bluntly, only an ignoramus would dismiss the detrimental effect of religion on human history. Religion definitely has caused many wars, even ones in which it wasn’t the sole motivator, but was the factor that prevented a conflict from being resolved. To say otherwise is just idiotic.

  • Quoting you: “You see, wars generally have multiple motivators, and are usually the result of longstanding conflicts that take time to become wars.”
    You copied and pasted it but are to ignorant and stupid to notice that Cavanaugh said that very thing!
    “…that all wars that are classed as ‘religious’ have a secular (economic or political) ramifications.”

  • Re: “Cavanaugh said that very thing!”

    Not if he said they never had religious motivations. Which is also what he said.

    I believe I explained how conflicts which are based on secular differences can escalate to wars, rather than just rivalries, once religion comes into play. In those cases, wars erupt that might never have erupted otherwise. And in those cases, the war itself — not the underlying rivalry that led up to it — would have been caused by religion.

    Look, I get where you’re coming from. Your Christianity is virtuous beyond critique. It’s the perfect faith. It never leads to conflict. That’s your position. It’s a flat-out lie, of course, but it’s your position. I also get that you’re not going to let go of it, no matter what you’re told.

    Oh, and you still haven’t acknowledged that the Crusades were a series of wars which had one primary motivator, that being Christianity. You purposely ignored that in order to evade the point I made. Which you are not going to get — because you want to remain an ignoramus.

    Good luck with your ignorance. Enjoy it.

  • Of course they were! Their slogan was “Gott mit uns,” or “God with us.” They were anti-Semites, and anti-Semitism in early 20th century Germany had one — and ONLY one — source: Christianity’s long history of anti-Semitism. It didn’t come from anywhere else.

  • The Jewish Pharisees that Jesus Christ identified as Satan’s seed in John 8:44, were primarily Edomite converts to Judaism — installed by King Herod, who was himself an Edomite.

    The distinction between Edomites and Jews was blurred by Johanan Hyrcanus’ forced conversion of [Edom] Idumea to Judaism in 130BC, recorded by historian Flavius Josephus in Antiquities of the Jews, Book 13: Chapter 9: Section 1).
    “Edom is in modern Jewry,” ~ (Jewish Encyclopedia, 1925 edition, Vol.5, p.41)

    The Apostle John describes these imposters as the “synagogue of Satan”, who “say they are Jews, and are not” (Revelation 2:9, Revelation 3:9).

    “Strictly speaking it is incorrect to call an Ancient Israelite a Jew or to call a contemporary Jew an Israelite or a Hebrew.” ~ (1980 Jewish Almanac, p. 3).

  • Followers of non-Christian religions deny that Jesus Christ is the Son of God and are therefore antichrist’s as per 1 John 2:22 “Who is a liar but he that denieth that Jesus is the Christ? He is antichrist, that denieth the Father and the Son.”

  • Christians are taught to love their personal enemies, not Christ’s enemies. Psalm 139:21-22 “Do not I hate them, O LORD, that hate thee? and am not I grieved with those that rise up against thee? I hate them with perfect hatred: I count them mine enemies.”

    Saint John Chrysostomos (his name meaning “golden mouthed” in English) stated: “For he who has no limits in his love of Christ must have no limits in his battle with those who hate Him, I hate the Jews.”

    The Orthodox Christian Church counts Saint John Chrysostomos among the Three Holy Hierarchs. https://orthodoxwiki.org/John_Chrysostom

    Saint John Chrysostomos wrote the “8 HOMILIES AGAINST THE JEWS” which helped shape Christian views on Jewry.

    Against the Jews: Preface to the online edition
    Homily 1
    Homily 2
    Homily 2 (missing portion)
    Homily 3
    Homily 4
    Homily 5
    Homily 6
    Homily 7
    Homily 8

  • I will remember that the next time I read about the various wars and atrocities committed by people acting in the name of their Christian faith.

    Thank you for pointing out that Christianity has its own fair share of nastiness.

    Thank you for pointing out to any christian apologists that neo Nazi hate has its origins with christian belief. Keep posting. You have proven my point on this thread.

  • You haven’t read any of it either nor bothered to find out how the religion is practiced. No different from the neo Nazi arguments using the old testament and Talmud. which they cut and paste from hate sites.

    So to make such assessments of an entire faith using such tactics is very much in line with what bigots and lazy people do.

    You act like hate filled nazi types, you get treated like one. Go figure.

  • Next time you hear the defeaning silence of American Jewry regarding Jewish Israeli atrocities in Gaza and the West bank, remember the implications of Rabbi Yitzhak Ginsburgh feeling comfortable enough to publish the below statement in Jewish Week. I doubt you will care though.

    “If a Jew needs a liver, can you take the liver of an innocent non-Jew passing by to save him? The Torah would probably permit that. Jewish life has an infinite value,” he explained. “There is something infinitely more holy and unique about Jewish life than non-Jewish life.” – Chabad Lubavitch Rabbi Yitzhak Ginsburgh in Jewish Week, the largest Jewish publication in the United States.

  • Nope you lost me there with the nonsense quote mining. No link to the quote? Probably as much bullshit as everything else here.

    But it’s good to see you are using the same nonsense tactics as the Islamaphobes. I was just telling them they were no better than neo nazis. You proved it. Good job.

  • Here are some more quotes for you. Chief Sephardic Rabbi of Israel, Ovadiah Yosef’s views were republished by the official Jewish Telegraphic Agency and are shown below: http://www.jta.org/2010/10/18/news-opinion/israel-middle-east/sephardi-leader-yosef-non-jews-exist-to-serve-jews

    “Goyim were born only to serve us. Without that, they have no place in the world; only to serve the People of Israel.”

    “Why are gentiles needed? They will work, they will plow, they will reap. We will sit like an effendi and eat,” he said to laughter during a weekly sermon.

    With gentiles, it will be like any person: They need to die, but God will give them longevity. Why? Imagine that one’s donkey would die, they’d lose their money. This is his servant. That’s why he gets a long life, to work well for this Jew.

  • From the same article:

    “The American Jewish Committee condemned the rabbi’s remarks in a statement issued Monday.

    “Rabbi Yosef’s remarks — suggesting outrageously that Jewish scripture asserts non-Jews exist to serve Jews — are abhorrent and an offense to human dignity and human equality,” said AJC Executive Director David Harris. “Judaism first taught the world that all individuals are created in the divine image, which helped form the basis of our moral code. A rabbi should be the first, not the last, to reflect that bedrock teaching of our tradition.”

    I guess this is why you don’t include links to quotes. Most of the time. Too often it shows you are using them in a dishonest fashion.

  • AJC Executive Director David Harris may have condemned Chief Sephardic Rabbi Ovadiah Yosef’s comments but Ovadiah Yosef’s views were quite popular among Jews in Israel. Over 800,000 Israelis—or 16 percent of the Jewish population of Israel—attended the funeral of former Chief Sephardic Rabbi of Israel, Ovadiah Yosef, making it the “LARGEST FUNERAL IN ISRAELI HISTORY.”
    http://www.timesofisrael.com/over-800000-pack-jerusalem-to-mourn-yosefs-passing/

    On Palestinians, Chief Sephardic Rabbi of Israel, Ovadiah Yosef had the following to say, as quoted by the BBC:
    http://news.bbc.co.uk/2/hi/middle_east/1270038.stm

    “It is forbidden to be merciful to them. You must send missiles to them and annihilate them. They are evil and damnable. The Lord shall return the Arabs’ deeds on their own heads, waste their seed and exterminate them, devastate them and vanish them from this world.

    ♦ “waste their seed” is a reference to Palestinian children.

  • I would ague that the Islamic conquests were all because “the allah god made me do it” Sura 2-193 and others. Yes, the booty and plunder and sex slaves taken were certainly iceing on the cake for Satan’s followers. The Islamic societies have done nothing for the betterment of mankind. Why would you do so (benefit mankind) if your allah god was calling you to kill and subjugate unbelievers and make Islam supreme?

  • Absolutely!
    The reason that the British, blonde-haired, blue-eyed “Lawrence of Arabia” was able to act as a spy in Arab lands is because of Islamic raiders taking captives from far northern latitudes long ago… he “passed” as just another Moslem.
    There is a famous 1985 ‘National Geographic’ cover photo of a women of stark beauty, who was a Afghan with blue eyes.

    https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Afghan_Girl

  • I hate Islam because to them, by Moslem Standards: “Success” is measured by what they have done to affect your “status” with them. (A.) Whether they have converted you, by any and all means, (B.) Subjected you to Dhimmi status and you have paid the 30% jizyah Tax, (C.) Cut off your hand and foot on opposite sides, (the same as if you were caught as a thief) or (D.) Killed you!

    Dhimmi: Non-Moslems living under Islamic law (Shariah), who enjoy legal status, but are subject to many oppressive restrictions and the jizyah tax. Also described as humans of second class, referring to the ‘People of the Book’, i.e. Jews and Christians.

    Jizyah tax: The extra tax imposed on non-Moslems (Dhimmis) who live under Moslem rule. The koran readily admits that it is a form of humiliation, meant to display the superior status of Moslems and the subdued state of non-Moslems. koran 9:29
    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=CfCK9MamU_A&feature=youtu.be

  • Neo Nazis aspire to be like the historic type. Neo Nazis are far from anti christian.

    The few who have infested this board can attest to that. See the postings of Roy Hobs and Strong119. You have the real deal here to see for yourself. Your assertions are silly in light of the actual evidence.

  • Mr. Potato Head, I am fully aware of Neo-Nazis being protestant “christians”, and you only have given evidence on them, and you’re right.
    But the argument is about Hitler’s Nazis, you give no evidence there!

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